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Organization of Meets
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Table of Contents
Once a Week Meets 8/98
Competition Styles 7/98
Different competition organization styles 9/97
Wish list this year 4/97
Distance lines 3/96
Throwers' events and number of entries 3/96
Tape Rule 3/96
More fun reading rule book 3/96
The uniform rule 6/95
How to run a shot and discus competition 6/95
Safety!!! 5/95
"Throwers only" meets 5/95
Educate People Who Are Running the Events! 2/95
Once a Week Meets 8/98
I was at a meet once last season and I heard an old grizzled coach say,"I remember the good old days when we had only one meet per week. I feel like all I do is go to meets!" Well, I thought about that a little bit. There have been times when I wondered if maybe we didn't have too many meets. What if we had one meet per week?
What about JVs, sophs, and frosh?
Well, how about having a JV division and a frosh or soph division at every meet? If everyone had 5-6 outdoor Fridays, not counting Drake, State, and conferences, that would be plenty of competition for these athletes.
What about qualifying for State/Drake?
If everyone decided on this format, everyone would get the same amount of chances. The weather would still be a variable, as it always was.
At the 4A boys' level, there are 48 teams. So that would mean every Friday, there would be 6-8 meets around the state. Of course, the scheduling would be a problem initially, but I think it could be fun and people wouldn't be run ragged every spring going to so many meets and it may be that spectators could count on the fact that "it's Friday, it's track meet day", like one can with football.
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Competition Styles 7/98
I have discussed this before, but I think that I have some new and different ideas.
1. "Raising the Bar" (like the high jump)
Throwers have a "starting distance" that they must achieve. I would say only 2 attempts at a distance. Good throwers can start when they choose, like a high jumper. Placings can be done either like the high jump, or by having the farther throw, like usual.
2. Head to Head Competition
Take8 to the finals. Seed them as usual, 1-8. Then have pairings and throwoff: 1 v. 8, 2 v. 7, etc. The winner of 1-8 would then throw against the 4-5, etc. Then the final two would throw-off. again, I think you could have placing by throwoffs or by best throw overall. One couldn't foul on the throwoff, which could make things interesting.
3. Modified traditional
8 to the finals, 8 get one throw in the finals, reorder, 4 get the next throw, reorder,2 get their last throws. Similar to T&FN, Aug. 98 idea. Overall farthest wins as usual.
4. Number of Throws
There has been a lot of talk about simply having 4 throws, period, not having 6 ever. The idea is that a thrower generally doesn't need 6. I can kind of see that. I can also see having just 3 throws. I had a meet with a tremendous number of throwers, so I simply made it in to a 3 throw only meet. No complaints.
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Different competition organization styles 9/97
There has been some discussion at many levels about whether or not to allow 6 throws in a competition. I have been at all kinds of meets, and here is what I've seen:
1. 3 throws only: Usually not enough
2. 4 throws only: Okay, but not for big competitions. Many think that this is all you need.
3. 3 prelims, 3 finals: The traditional way
4. 6 throws only: Not much different than #3, fine for a small number of competitors
5. 3 or 4 throws- all in a row: I HATE THIS! People think this saves time. It does not!
6. 3 or 4 throws- 2 entries in to the ring: Same as #5
7. "Cafeteria-style" throwing: Same as #5 and #6. Even worse because of organizational problems.
8. Flights of 30: Same as #5, #6, and #7
9. Flights with no warmups in between: Not fair to anyone in later flights.
10. "Hadda bedda"- person marking determines if the thrower "hadda bedda" throw and decides whether it should be measured: You are at the mercy of the measurer. Plus it takes away the secondary throw as a tie-breaker.
11. Various distance limitations that are not measured: Takes away the secondary throw as a tie-breaker, plus in some cases, throwers deserve to have a mark. Distances chosen are arbitrary.
12. 3 prelims, 3 finals, flights of reasonable length, warmups between flights, all legal throws measured, throwers take one throw at a time: I do actually see this.
I am really okay with the idea of four throws. Three seems like not quite enough, except for maybe younger throwers. I favor the traditional approach (see #12).
Here's a thought that intrigues me. How about running a throwing competition like the high jump. Start out at a low distance, throw that, and you're still in, if not, you're out. Move up 5 feet at a time, and maybe 2 feet at the higher distances. I'm not sure that 3 tries at each distance would work: maybe 2. Obviously, the good throwers can use lower distances as warmups. You would be assured that the best throwers would still be in at the end. I'm sure about details, like what would you do if someone came in at 30' and threw 60' once then quit. That would take away some of the excitement. Maybe say, sure throw 60' but it will only count as acheiving the 30' distance. I'd like to try it sometime.
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Wish list this year 4/97
1. No meets with one big flight of 30.
2. No meets where they try to run the varsity competitions simultaneously so that the thrower
has to run back and forth between events.
3. No waiting for an athlete running another event.
4. No meets where an athlete can take whatever number of throws they want to at a time.
5. No meets where there are no warmups in the competition ring.
6. Officials yelling out distances so people can hear.
7. Lines on fields marked in a reasonable and relatively accurate manner.
8. No coaches being asked to help run an event.
9. Get rid of the magical 5:00 starting time; you can't run the throwing events in the dark.
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Distance lines 3/96
I have been to too many meets where there were no distance lines in the sector. Even though it probably shouldn't make a difference, it does. Throwers like to have a point of reference. An extreme example was at the State Meet waaaay back in'81, where there were no distance lines at all. Not good for competitors or spectators.
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Throwers' events and number of entries 3/96
Every once in a while, I get a little crazy. I was thinking about how if you have three good sprinters on a track team, you have all kinds of events for them to do. But, if you have three good throwers, in most meets, there are only 2 spots in the shot and discus. If you are the third best thrower, you are out of luck. If you are the third or fourth or fifth best sprinter, there is a spot for you.
Solution one:
Allow three entries for the shot and discus in all meets. Because of the nature of the events, there no other places to put a third thrower. You really don't need to do the same for running events, because the third runner has other individual events and relays that they can do. It should not be a big problem for the well-run throwing competition.
Solution two:
Add the weight throw. The hammer or javelin would not go over well as they take up a lot of space. However, a good weight thrower would not throw more than 60-70 feet. You would have to get inserts for the discus ring, as it is a 7 foot ring, and get a weight or two. They have iron ones and indoor ones. The indoor ones are more expensive and bigger, but a little safer because of their construction. I would advocate the 25 lb. variety. Again, this would give a thrower another event. As it is now, throwers have only two possible events. A sprinter can potentially have four with choices of: 100, 200, 400, 4x1, 4x2, 4x4, medley, 110H, 400H, LJ.
I think solution one is easily doable, but solution two is admittedly idealistic. I have shelved my fantasy of adding the javelin.
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Tape Rule 3/96
I went to a meet where taping the wrist in the discus was deemed illegal. I checked the rulebook and it said:
(6-3-7 of National Federation rule book '96)
"No taping of any part of the hands or fingers will be permitted in the discus event unless there is an open wound that must be protected by tape."
It says nothing about taping the wrist. As far as I'm concerned, it is okay to tape your wrist for the discus, especially since there are many meets where they require the thrower to bounce back and forth between events. It says nothing about taping the wrist in the shot section, but yet that is universally accepted.
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More fun reading rule book 3/96
Here's some more interesting stuff:
6-2-6: To paraphrase, throwing events should be conducted in one session. The girls' state meet has that prelims in the a.m. and finals in the afternoon stuff.
6-4-9: It does mention exiting from the back half of the ring, but does not mention from where to enter. It does not say to exit under control. I'm not sure what to make of that.
6-4-11: Measure to the nearest lesser inch in the discus. I'm too often seeing 1/2" measurements at meets.
Points of special emphasis (p.69): 3. No practice throws unsupervised, or from any area except the official throwing area.
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The uniform rule 6/95
I have seen some problems arising
recently regarding the uniform rule. It seems that many throwers or coaches
of throwers either ignore the rule or are not aware of the rule. I think
this comes from the fact that throwers are often a lot bigger than the other
track athletes and so uniforms available are either too small or uncomfortably
small and skimpy. I also think that this occurs sometimes because of throwers
at some schools being unsupervised and so the athletes feel that they can
do whatever they want to. Finally, since they've been to meets where it
has not been enforced, it reinforces the idea that the uniform rule does
not apply to them.
Nobody wants to be the bad guy and call people on this. What we need to
do is make sure that we make an effort to get extra big equipment for our
extra big athletes. Also, if you are running a meet, make it clear that
the uniform rule will be in effect right from the start so situations don't
arise during the competition.
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How to run a shot and discus competition 6/95
I talked about this in the very
first Chain Mail. I have seen too many weirdly and poorly run shot and discus
competitions!!
I do have another suggestion to add. Let's say you have a varsity only meet
and you want or have to run the events at the same time. What many have
done is simply take the throwers in one event and reverse the order for
the other. That makes sense, unless you're in the middle flight of both
events, then you're running around again. I suggest the following:
1. Take one event and put the throwers in order and in flights.
2. Shift the flights by one or two so that throwers in flight one of event
A are in flight two of event B, and flight twos in event A are in flight
three of event B, and so on. The last flight throwers for event A would
then be in the first flight of event B. I have also done it so that throwers
were shifted over two flights so they have a little break: Flight one of
event A goes to flight three of event B, and so on.
3. This can only be done if the flights don't get too far ahead of each
other and you alow warmup time inbetween flights.
4. I prefer that the finals of the events not be run at the same time. Perhaps
the order of this can be predetermined.
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Safety!!! 5/95
Every once in awhile, you have to remind
yourself that then shot and discus events have a lot of safety factors to
keep in mind and to teach to the athletes.
After a close call experience I witnessed recently where an athlete got
hit in the shoulder by a discus on the fly at about 100', it has made me
really think about throwers' safety.
1.Discus Cages: Great idea. I wish that they weren't so darn expensive.
2.No javelin or hammer: There is no javelin or hammer in a lot of
states because of safety and expense. Shot and discus are equally as dangerous.
we need to make sure that we stay safe so that there doesn't become a call
for the elimination of these events. The events are easy targets because
of safety, expense (high expense, low participation), and liability.
3.Discus markers: Educate markers! I saw a kid at the Drake Relays
last year get nailed by a discus in the leg after a number of close calls.
4.Spectators: Drake Relays this year had no flags to keep back spectators.
If you are going to stand close to the sector, be watching and be standing
so you can move. The Drake people are looking at some liability problems
if they don't provide some sort of barrier for spectators.
5.Competitors: Watch out as you're wandering out to retrieve implements!
I try to have someone do it for them so that they don't have to worry about
it.
6.Practice: In the shot, I have the throwers rotate: throw, retrieve,
wait. There should only be one person out in the sector and their only job
is to retrieve. In the discus, I have a lot discuses. We all throw them
and then we all retrieve at once. No one is out in the sector while someone
is throwing. Also, I have to sometimes practice at a ring with no cage,
so I often remind throwers to stay well back from the ring while someone
is throwing.
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"Throwers only" meets 5/95
I have had this idea for a throwers only
meet. I have seen similar things advertised in USA Thrower. Does anyone
have any ideas on this? I have thought about the following formats:
Unlimited entries
After the season (early June)
During the season
Co-ed
Limited entries
Invitation only: top throwers from each class
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Educate People Who Are Running the Events! 2/95
On this subject, I have two pet peeves (probably more, but just two for now). One is having to run or help run a meet as a coach. What other sport's coaches have to do this? I know sometimes it's unavoidable, but I wish it happened rarely instead of a lot. The other is watching poorly run meet. Here are my thoughts on this (add yours if you have any ideas):
1. DO NOT ALLOW TWO OR THREE OR FOUR THROWS IN A ROW!! People think this is a time saver. It is not!! If athletes know the order, it should go quickly with one throw at a time. Multiple throws in a row mean the thrower throws, sees the mark, thinks about it, decides whether to go again, checks with the coach, cleans off the implement, changes the implement, checks the wind, cleans off their shoes...you get the idea. DON'T RUN A MEET LIKE THAT! It is not done like that at the collegiate and international levels and it's not done like that at Drake or State!
2. Keep throwers informed. Always let them know what flight they're in, and be yelling out who is up, who's on deck, and who's in the hole. Do this loudly enough to be heard.
3. Don't flip-flop events. The mental and physical preparation for each event is different. As much as possible, run the preliminary throws and the finals of an event right in a row.
4. YELL OUT THE MEASUREMENTS! Everyone wants to know!
5. When possible, get entries days before the meet and seed them. Seed them worst first to best. Odds are much greater that the better throwers will be in the finals, so why make them sit and wait? Many times, when done this way, the throwers will only want a relatively short warmup period before the finals. Otherwise, if they've had to sit around, they'll want and need a longer warmup period.
6. Allow warmups in the same ring that they will compete on. Few sports have you warmup at a different place than where the competition occurs. Not all rings are the same.
7. Allow warmups between flights and before the finals.
8. Whenever possible, don't run the two events simultaneously. If it is a co-ed meet, run boys' shot and girls' disc at the same time, and then switch. If it is JV and varsity, run JV shot during varsity disc.
9. HAVE FLIGHTS! I have been to too many meets where it's just one flight of 30. I think flights of no less than 4 and no more than 8 is good.
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