Glide Shotput RevelationsNorm's Throws Home * * Ramblings * * Categories
Shotput Shenanigans
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Table of Contents
Glide Shotput Revelations 10/97
More Rotational Shotput 5/97
The Power Position in the Shotput 5/97
Differences Between Rotational Shot and the Discus 4/97
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Glide Shotput Revelations
I have really changed my outlook on the shotput within the last year. As a coach, I have gone from all glide with a little spin added, to trying to do as much spin as possible, to back to rethinking the glide as the major technique. This all began with a discussion of the differences between the so-called European Glide and the Feuerbach style of the glide. I have done a lot of reading and discussing with coaches and have come to the conclusion that I need to give the European style of gliding a try. What are the differences, you may ask? (assuming a right handed thrower, and that the direction of the throw is 12 o'clock in the descriptions)
| Glide factors | European Glide | Feuerbach Glide |
| Stance at power position | Wide: right foot past half | Right foot at the center |
| Right foot placement in power position | Can vary: 4-4:30, 3 o'clock not necessary | 3 o'clock is the goal |
| Rhythm of the grounding of the feet in power position | Right-left | Simultaneous |
| Left arm position during glide | Stays at 6 o'clock mostly, some opening allowed | No opening allowed |
| Right foot pivot in the power position | Not emphasized | Emphasized |
| Weight on right leg at power position | Yes | Yes |
What got me thinking was that this technique seemedto be more like a "natural" throwing motion, where the right lands first, then the left. This occurs in throwing baseballs, footballs, javelins, discuses, hammers, anything. One of the things that happens when you are overly concerned with getting the right leg under in the power position while trying to get both feet to land simultaneously, is that you stop the momentum gained from the glide. The European style keeps the ball moving, with less hesitation. The key is to keep the ball moving in as straight of a line as possible, as fast as possible, with a release at an optimum angle.
Does this mean that the Feuerbach technique is somehow bad? It has worked for some throwers. It is extremely difficult to do what he does and maintain momentum across the ring. It is possible that many have worked on attaining that power position to the detriment of other skills to be developed. Worst case scenario, the athlete may not have the ability to handle that maneuver and efficiently apply maximum force to the ball. The European technique seems to be a bit simpler to teach and more throwers can physically hit the positions.
Does it mean that I don't like the spin? No. But I'm starting to wonder if it is just too hard for the average high school thrower. If you are only training for 3-4 weeks before your first meet and then the meets come twice to three times a week after that, I don't know if you can get the consistent work you need to have to become competent in the spin. I'm not giving up on it, though.
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More Rotational Shotput
I had a coach (who will remain nameless) say to me at the first meet of the year, "So I thought all of your guys were spinning this year. How come they're not?" Good question.
What I am doing is having the majority of their work spinning. Then when they get to a meet there needs to be a decision as to which technique to use. The object of the meet is to throw as far as possible, and if they can throw far gliding, they should glide. That doesn't mean that they won't eventually spin.
Here's an analogy: Suppose you had a paper to type and you needed to get it done fast. You have been a "hunt and peck" typist for awhile. But you are currently taking a class where you are learning to type correctly, using home keys, not looking at the keyboard, etc. Now you know you can type "correctly", but you want to get this paper done quickly. So of course, you are going to "hunt and peck". Months later, as you get better from practicing for your class, you find that you are really typing instead of hunting and pecking.
Same thing for the glider who is changing to the spin. The glide is like "hunting and pecking" and the spin is like "correct" typing technique. That is not saying that the glide is easier. But you generally do not suddenly say, "I'm a spinner," and you are automatically better than your glide. What I am advocating is that you keep the glide in reserve as you learn the spin. Eventually, it will become obvious as to which technique is best for the individual. But you must give the spin a serious try before a "final" decision is made. Even then I think that it is a good idea to keep doing drills with it as a help for discus and simply to break up the monotony of the glide, which can happen.
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The Power Position in the Shotput
Much is discussed about foot placement in the shotput power position. The goal is to apply force to the shot over as long of a distance as is possible and reasonable. Taken to the extreme, you could get a super wide base and bend way over, and you would be "applying force over a long distance". However, that is unreasonable, as you could not get out of that position very easily. It's sort of like if you want to jump high, you don't begin in a full squat position. That's why I added the word "reasonable". That "reasonableness" will vary from thrower to thrower.
My guideline is: Is the shot behind the right leg? (opposite for lefties). If you dropped the shot, would it land on you or on the area to the right of your right leg? For the most part, the width of the feet are npot as important as that guideline.
If the guideline is the shot placement, then what about the left arm? Theoretically, it could be in a lot of different places and still be okay. In fact, some coaches use different cues. Some say, "Lock the shot back", or" keep the shoulder(s) back" (not the left arm). I still think that keeping the left arm back is the best cue for the stand throw because of the length of the lever it can do a lot for keeping one's weight back and it's big and easy to visualize.
What about the orientation of the right foot? One sees a range of ideas from the "Feuerbach" at 90 degrees to the "European" at around 45 degrees. Gliders I think must strive for 90, but it is a very difficult maneuver, that's why you don't see too many gliders achieving this. Rotational putters don't need to be as concerned about it, as it is a position that is "moved through" more than for the glider, who actually do hit that position briefly.
Do not allow throwers to only become great stand throwers. Try to have them be in a position as they would be in a glide when they do their stand throws. Do not allow them to 'bounce" through the throw or to "whip" the free arm. You can't do this during the glide, so why would you in a stand throw. You do not want to work on something that is not related to the full throw. Have throwers go back to the proper power position, FREEZE, then execute the throw. Think legs first. Finish tall, head up, chest out. Punch the shot.
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Differences Between Rotational Shot and the Discus
As you look at the practitioners of this technique, you see that the windup is different than the discus in that the thrower is bent at the waist a bit and is generally lower. Also as the thrower moves through the middle of the ring, there is a more pronounced "wrap" of the non throwing arm. In a general sense, the rotational shot is made up of smaller, tighter, and lower movements than the rotational discus. This is because of the smaller ring, the orientation of the weight in relation to the thrower, and because the shot must be released at a higher angle than the discus because the shot is not aerodynamic. The smaller ring makes you have to have a different timing with your first step because you can't just stretch it out to the middle like in the discus. Especially at first, you have to control that first turn more. This is usually more of a concern with a tall thrower. In the discus, the weight of the implement is far away from the center of gravity, in the shot the weight of the implement is close to the center of gravity. In the discus, you can kind of "get away with getting a good pull on the disc if you have good flexibility in the shoulder and simply "keeping the discus arm loose". In the shot, you must find a way to keep your weight back and that is why there is the "wrap" in the middle of the ring with the free arm. It helps to keep the weight back. This maneuver also helps with getting lift on the shot.
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